What's the purpose of the gender field?

For how it distributes physical advantage, it will forever be a relevant metric of security, if only a metric here. A search makes finding the split in overall weaker individuals easier, for either good or bad, and the difference made in knowing what people select is a bit more involved.

Moving a free-form field to “Male”, “Female” and “Non-binary” really means only the latter is conveyed, and no further nebulous options.
Seeing as people have no difficulty deciding sex based on profile picture, it makes people opting for the third category searchable. How this is better for security I don’t know, but it certainly narrows it right down, or splits your candidates down the middle for convenience or malice.
Relevantly, this setting is not user-selectable, which means someone thought establishing entropy there was important for reasons I can only assume to be security-related.

In the case of females or males trying to be something else,
males carry their natural physical advantage over women.

These will largely be visually obvious, and make up the non-binary category even if not.
Allowing people to discriminate based on this metric in search makes it even easier to single out these in the greater pool, and also easier to find. I don’t see that as largely better.
If it isn’t a category at all, then there is no need to “misrepresent” ones non-binary choice for this reason. If it doesn’t have to be selected, it is a passable excuse not to make it, but then it can’t be required like it is now.

With males carrying advantageous strength into either other category, further it has to be biologically based for it to make a difference when those select “Female”.

“Man” and “Woman” doesn’t make a difference to “Male” and “Female”, and “masculine” and “feminine” is only secondary categories within that to people.
There is some personal pronoun setting, with “he/him” “she/her” and “free form”.
If the “gender” isn’t biological in the sense that personal pronoun follows, the system is rigged towards some level of stable choices, and giving away anomalies in there and in pronouns as much as possible within a user-choice system. Though right now it is right next to gender, so it tricks people that wouldn’t flag pronouns into doing so. Almost did it myself.

Whether by rationale by breakdown of crime-statistics or other underlying thought, I am not privy to it or the strategy of using it.
Will the user be prevented from changing the “gender” option when there is a pending negative review?

As the attacks to worry the most about are largely of a sexual nature, it makes a lot more sense to allow distinguishing oneself by and subsequently searching by sexual attraction. That carries the disadvantage of being protected information, so special consent is needed to collect and display it. The clever way is to have a group called “Rainbow” and then let people search by both.
I think that makes it a less convenient dating-app than its functionality would allude to, and gives more up-front info, if not a better or additional way to navigate ones security.

If profile picture is all one has to go by, people will scrutinize it more in depth, and it will be harder to pretend to be someone else than selecting a setting. That isn’t very hard, with makes it not very reliable. If you want to be anonymous for security reasons, that is largely going to select for females, and those can more-so operate without a profile picture.

It isn’t harder to fake a profile picture than it is to change a setting, but ultimately no political correctness will save anyone from using a non-available picture of someone else.
Thus, the ratings are valuable, but I think pronouns and selecting gender may create more drama, confusion and mistaken identity than benefit.
In planning to meet a woman without a profile picture, one would likely think that is fine even with no rating, I think a system of categories that can’t be changed easily lull people into thinking a “female” or “woman” has to be something other than a selection, especially since interpreting broadly from available info is the human condition.

Short of a full and actual review, the conditions for IRL damage are not met.
Having someone send illicit messages up front is better than the same ban with more interaction and reviews to be written.
Mitigating malice is easier by not only rewarding, but requiring sunken cost.
It is not only smart to go with people with extensive descriptions in their reviews because you meet a less random person that fits you better, but a potential ill-doer is looking to give away as little hard info as possible so as to get away or to be able to do it again as habitual as one allows navigating social hierarchy to be.
Writing full messages has the same vectors. At worst it gives more info to go by, and it is harder to fake.

Moderators could ask to have evidence made that you are the person in your profile picture.
Asking to have a picture of yourself or video-chat of holding up a pillow to the left of your face is harder to fake on the fly. Or something similar to it could be asked for to make an avatar.
There are plenty of ways to weed out fake profiles, but that is for another day and not something to put in recipe form.

AI can already distinguish both sex and sexual attraction by a meaningful profile picture alone.

TL;DR I am not sure pronouns and s/electable gender isn’t just bloat, when it could be free-formed into the open profile sections anyway. There it is an active choice, with which linguistic discretion can be employed if need be.

As long as you don’t verify everyone, you are misleading people into thinking nobody will make fake profiles.

You are contemplating the notion of preventing people from having freedom of association, and failing because the premise is it would happen anyway.

It seems the language du jour changes as quickly when it enters the NHS.

To avoid the medical faux pas of the same NHS as it has tried to apply these concepts,
how about just recording sex and calling it as such?
No registration is also possible.

Where can I educate myself about the reasons and evidence that women might benefit from hiding their profiles from certain people (whether based on gender or otherwise)?

I feel this thread is focused on how the gender field could be applied as a solution, but regardless of how it’s implemented, reducing the visibility of any member can have other ripple effects on the community, and I’d really like to understand the underlying need, as well as the possible consequences of doing (or not doing) something about it.

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Hi Simon, not sure who you’re replying to or what part of their reply drew your attention, but I will try to answer. We know from the popularity of Host A Sister, an all-women Facebook group with nearly 200,000 members, that there is a gap in the existing hospex platforms for something geared specifically toward, for, or even by women. Although Couchers.org is not currently in a position to create an all-women platform, one of the ways we could cater to the gap is by allowing women to have an “only women” experience on Couchers.org.

The idea is not for users to exclude people - instead, this idea would aim to include women who previously did not participate in hospex platforms because they do not want to interact with men, at all, full stop. We cannot say how many women there are that would specifically join Couchers.org if we had this feature, because to my knowledge it has never been done before. But if it’s even a fraction of the 200,000 that were attracted to the men-free concept of Host A Sister, I think it’s worth a shot.

There are already women from the couch-surfing community who have expressed a desire to have a profile on one of the existing platforms, but aren’t comfortable with being seen by men for religious/cultural/safety reasons. The experience of being seen or contacted by men is not something that all women around the world are comfortable with, but does that mean they should not be able to participate in hosting/surfing?

In addition, I believe it would be a useful feature for women users in temporary situations, such as traveling or living certain countries where unwanted attention and solicitations from men is overwhelming - anecdotally, Italy, Morocco, Turkey, India, etc, in no particular order, come to mind. Another time it could come in handy to be able to temporarily hide your profile is if and when you are being stalked or harassed. I could see myself hiding my profile temporarily for a while if I really only want to host women for the next few weeks or months and don’t want men to even contact me for being hosted (this would save both parties a lot of time, by the way - some women are simply never going to host men).

On a smaller scale, women being able to show certain activity only to other women could help in instances where a woman wants to…

  • be open to meet up/do hangouts, but only with other women
  • post a public trip, but not have any men to see that public trip
  • host an event exclusively for women

Try not to think of it as affecting the current/existing community because we already know that probably most, if not all of the women on couchers.org right now wouldn’t really hide/show their profiles and are obviously to some degree fine with the way things are. What Couchers.org should be working on (in addition to rolling out the basic features that we all want!!) is advocating for the members who aren’t here yet and have no voice because of the status quo.

I would like to add as a final note that ultimately I would hope that less and less women would feel the need to hide anything as they become more comfortable, open to new experiences, and able to trust others with our work to build a tight-knit and self-regulating community. From many conversations with other women who “would never do couchsurfing” over the years, it’s clear that most have the wrong idea about how it works and how “dangerous” it is. I think this would be a good sell to at least getting them to try it.

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Thank you for a very detailed answer. You’ve given me a lot of context, and helped confirm some things that are consistent with anecdotes from female friends, or that I have witnessed, but that I have not personally been on the receiving end of.
Also, motives for wanting this, such as religion and culture are even less familiar for me, so it helps me (and presumably others) to be aware of them.

I think there would be a lot of complexity, in terms of deciding where a platform that allows an all-gender experience for some members, can simultaneously support an “only women” experience for those who opt into it. At certain points, the two groups would overlap, and there would need to be decisions around what they are allowed to do, and how effective safeguarding can take place.

This isn’t me arguing against the idea, just demonstrating potential complexity, which would need careful decision making, and would carry some risk of unintended consequences.

Try not to think of it as affecting the current/existing community

I do believe it can affect all members, and although we can consider the scale of that, and whether it is proportionate that any negative effects would weigh significantly against the benefits, IMO we should acknowledge the potential downsides, even for members who aren’t able to use it.

For example, would such a member be able to participate in discussions and events that are open to all genders? If so, would male participants be able to see the contributions of the member with “only women” turned on?
Also, what if (as a man), I would leave a negative reference about someone I see being abusive to women? Should a woman with the “only women” experience be able to see that?
What if a woman with the “only women” experience visits a female host, who also has a male guest at the time, should either guest be able to see each other’s profiles, or leave each other a reference?
What if they both join their host to a couchsurfing event, should both members be able to join it, and if they do, should other members be able to see who has joined?

So I find it really good that you’ve illuminated so clearly why this is important, as I believe it would be relevant to ongoing discussions, about whether and how such a feature would be implemented, and what it means, not just technically, but for the interactions of all community members, both on- and off-line.

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terrible idea man. just let people search what they search for. you are doing too much here. the search engine is what makes couchsurf so appealing

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Some dudes accept only girls, which is partially defines creepy guys (no offense , you know what I am talking about)
So, your motivation hiding this from search is not useful.

oh, I also found a lot of dudes on CS only accepting dudes.

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I thought that was the whole point of couchers, to avoid the lechers and rapists. CS turned into a nasty hookup site. I’m not here as a member to provide cover for rapists (ei there are women members here). Sorry not fucking sorry.

I’m a native Spanish speaker, and there is a difference (sex: sexo, gender: género). The thing is, in most of Spanish speaking countries, most of the people (who usually don’t know a lot about gender identity) think sex and gender are the same due to the lack of education regarding sexual diversity.

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